Making Baby Jesus Cry

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
I haven't picked it up yet. This is my brain on sober. Scared?

Pick UP the wine, and relax some more . . .

(Still in the same place? 'Cuz i iwll be too . . .)

[sebastian_dangerfield]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
The liberals have no faith in the electorate. they are elitists, not populists. They cannot win at the ballot box or by referendum so they must seek to impose their faux-intellectual elitism by judicial fiat. Thankfully the people are on to them.

I am an elitist. Most of this country is too stupid or too self interested to be allowed to vote. 40 million of them are waiting for a fucking rapture. Perfect, imperfect, whatever... if you toy with Roe and give that issue to the states, we are going to have a political nightmare on our hands.

I have faith that Bush is elitist enough to nominate his elitist buddy Gonzales to the Court to see to it that such a disaster doesn't happen.

BTW, I am not a liberal, Penske. I'm a life long GOP registered voter (recently switched to libertarian) who's split his vote all over the place. I'm part of the thinking portion of this country - the socially liberal fiscal conservatives. We're the sleeping giant, and you nuts on the fringes are pushing your luck. We will get a Chuck Hagel of Rudy Guiliani elected, and it will be soon. And that will be curtains for the Jesus Nazis and the Berkeley know it all pseudo-intellectuals.

[Spanky]

I have been a member of the Federalist society for seventeen years (I was a student member). I have always been a strict constructionist. I especially hate the Miranda ruling and the exlusionary rule.

But until I saw that West Wing episode common law rights in the United States never occurred to me. If there were (and are) common law rights, then a court making up new rights is not so crazy. Especially the highest court in the land.

Does anyone know anything about common law rights in the United States?

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by bilmore
The scary thing is, if they ever gave in and let the people decide it, they'd be on the winning side. That's why no real Republican wants Roe to be overturned.

I disagree (and am not sure what you mean by real R). I think the majority in a majority of states are closer to what I think (i.e. some abortion rights but more limited than today) than they are to what the law is today. There are a handful of places that would have less regs than today and at least one that might ban it.

On other related issues, like parental notification, I think the tide would turn conservative.

Maybe I am wrong, but I would take that chance, if for no other reason than the entertainment value of watching the liberals go up in smoke when teh decision came down. Given our advanced ages Billmoore, we probably would be dead by the time there was a full resolution across the 50 states, but would have lived with a life time of chuckles over that melt down. Just think of Gloria Allred and Susan Estrich and the howl that would result.

Pinch me, Im dreamin!!

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Spanky
Actually the story was that the members of the Georgia legislature used this as a reason not to vote for the Bill of Rights. This occurred after the Constitution was accpeted and when the Bill of Rights was being sent to the state legislatures. This was the reason given for specifically voting against the Bill of Rights.

If people in the Georgia legislature were worried that if you list rights in the constitution that people will later assume that these are the only rights, isn't their fear being realized right now by the strict constructionists?

Yes.

(You got me on the history. I thought you were coming from a much less informed place. Bad me.)

But the counter-argument back then was, still, that the list gave some certainty, and didn't leave us in the position of trying to read intent. I wish they did a fifty-page brief on what they meant.

(Mostly I wish that because I'm harmonious with what I think they meant. If I wanted more - "privacy"! - I'd wish we could prove they only meant ot lead by example. Evidence seems to go the other way, fortunately.)

[SlaveNoMore]

y bilmore
Wow, you're old.

Are you asking if the Georgia tale was true? Certainly it was. The fear about listing rights was that there were tons of rights that everyone recognized, and if you made a list, you'd miss some. That's why the BOR came later - it was only after a few months that some signers recognized that they'd better start listing them, because the lg body seemed to feel a freedom in the absence of a list.

As I recall George Mason refused to endorse the Bill of Rights and Jefferson was specifically irked by the exclusion of certain liberties.

That such parties were so concerned by the absence of certain words lends even more weight to the idea that their absence from the Constitution was deliberate.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by sebastian_dangerfield
I am an elitist. Most of this country is too stupid or too self interested to be allowed to vote. 40 million of them are waiting for a fucking rapture. Perfect, imperfect, whatever... if you toy with Roe and give that issue to the states, we are going to have a political nightmare on our hands.

I have faith that Bush is elitist enough to nominate his elitist buddy Gonzales to the Court to see to it that such a disaster doesn't happen.

BTW, I am not a liberal, Penske. I'm a life long GOP registered voter (recently switched to libertarian) who's split his vote all over the place. I'm part of the thinking portion of this country - the socially liberal fiscal conservatives. We're the sleeping giant, and you nuts on the fringes are pushing your luck. We will get a Chuck Hagel of Rudy Guiliani elected, and it will be soon. And that will be curtains for the Jesus Nazis and the Berkeley know it all pseudo-intellectuals.

I am not a jesus nazi, I just have more respect for the freedoms and rights of all of the people of the country, even the babyjesi. I may be smarter than most, but that doesn not give me more rights. You are in the wrong country with that attitude because that's not what the consitution or BoR is about. No wonder you are able to find made up stuff in it, you are missing the whole point.

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by Spanky
I have been a member of the Federalist society for seventeen years (I was a student member)

2.

[SlaveNoMore]

Spanky
Actually the story was that the members of the Georgia legislature used this as a reason not to vote for the Bill of Rights. This occurred after the Constitution was accpeted and when the Bill of Rights was being sent to the state legislatures. This was the reason given for specifically voting against the Bill of Rights.

If people in the Georgia legislature were worried that if you list rights in the constitution that people will later assume that these are the only rights, isn't their fear being realized right now by the strict constructionists?

Georgia (and the other Southern states) were also, at the time, petrified of the notion of a strong centralized federal government - recall, the Jeffersonians wanted a loose knit of agrarian-centered states, a la the Articles of Confederation - so they were fully satisfied with the protections of the 10th Amendment.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
As I recall George Mason refused to endorse the Bill of Rights and Jefferson was specifically irked by the exclusion of certain liberties.

That such parties were so concerned by the absence of certain words lends even more weight to the idea that their absence from the Constitution was deliberate.

True to some extent, but these were highly practical, empiricist guys. A "right to privacy"? Never woulda happened. But, I havta think that these guys sort of assumed that. "Don't tread on me" sort of implies "get out of my fucking bedroom", doesn't it? I think Tom J would have had a fit if the gov agents stopped him from screwing his mistress, or his cute little buddy down the street. Not the job of government, I picture Tom crying.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by Penske_Account
2.

3

(Oh, shit. That was supposed to be secret.)

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by bilmore
Not the job of government, I picture Tom crying.

Like the babyjesus before him.

[SlaveNoMore]

Spanky
Does anyone know anything about common law rights in the United States?

Yes?

Do you have a specific question - or do you need to be told where to Google like paigow?

[Penske_Account]

Originally posted by bilmore
3

(Oh, shit. That was supposed to be secret.)

Don't worry, Ty will censor it later.

[bilmore]

Originally posted by SlaveNoMore
do you need to be told where to Google like paigow?

No one can google like Paigow.

Heck, you oughta know . . . .

nevermind.